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Originally posted by grim53@Jun 28 2004, 04:06 PM

well i personally was hopeing for a new visuall style out of tiger. i know panther dosn't look too differn't for jaguar. but it still someting.

from the previews. it just looks like panther with some new apps and features.

Even the wallpaper is the same. Something, not the most wanted, I wanted was a new aqua wallpaper, oh well. Maybe later.

Even the logo. No new Tiger "X"? The same Panther "X" with a Tigerlike background?! Retarded.

While we are talking of Tiger and this new preview minisite, anyone feel up to making this icon?

// Lou

#183259

exaclty. it just looks like panther! not even the default wallpaper was changed.

from a visual stand point. there dosn't seem to be much of an update.

atleast with what we have to go with.

#183261

Originally posted by nightcrawler1089@Jun 28 2004, 09:03 PM

Everyone's really upset over these screenshots of Tiger- just out of curiousity, what were you expecting?

(That's not sarcasm- I'm actually asking "What were you expecting to be new in Tiger?").

Well I was expecting Apple to begin and get with the program and use Direct X instead of Open GL, and also was expecting a new (Original) theme, maybe a mix of Smooth Panther with some of the GUI pod elements (the orange for Tiger :naughty: ) and also a new option to support multiple docks on multiple screens, and or the same one. If not then a cool NEW invention to split the dock so you have different ones for different catorgories. Like Taber thing. And also LOTS of new 3D transitions. And a fully 3D desktop like Project Looking Glasses. And of course stuff that Apple used to do. Original invetions..Maybe they've preety much covered everything. All I know is that (my personal opinion) Apple isn't getting better..Microsoft is.

What do you guys/gals expected??

#183266

Maybe this is more like the transition from 2000 to XP, or XP Home to XP Professional, than it is from 98 to XP.

Ok, that looks confusing. What I'm trying to say is Windows 98 to XP was a really big change in GUI. XP Home to XP Professional is almost no changes in GUI, just changes in other stuff.

See what I mean? Although, I agree, no new visual style or wallpaper is a little disappointing. But hey- it's his (Steve's) company, he can do whatever he wants.

-nightcrawler1089

P.S- I know this is Off-Topic, but who makes the button's that are in Lou's sig, and were (or maybe still are) in Magbi9's sig? Is it Lou?

Edit:Oh, babypapichulo, you are about to get bashed by the Microsoft bashers! I can't believe you just said Microsoft is getting better and Apple isn't. You just personally insulted at least half the members here.

#183270

Originally posted by babypapichulo@Jun 28 2004, 05:16 PM

Well I was expecting Apple to begin and get with the program and use Direct X instead of Open GL, and also was expecting a new (Original) theme, maybe a mix of Smooth Panther with some of the GUI pod elements (the orange for Tiger  :naughty: ) and also a new option to support multiple docks on multiple screens, and or the same one. If not then a cool NEW invention to split the dock so you have different ones for different catorgories. Like Taber thing. And also LOTS of new 3D transitions. And a fully 3D desktop like Project Looking Glasses. And of course stuff that Apple used to do. Original invetions..Maybe they've preety much covered everything. All I know is that (my personal opinion) Apple isn't getting better..Microsoft is. 

What do you guys/gals expected??

/jaw drops in utter disbelief.

babypapichulo I've said it before and I will say it once again. You are a complete moron.

#183273

Originally posted by babypapichulo@Jun 28 2004, 09:16 PM

Well I was expecting Apple to begin and get with the program and use Direct X instead of Open GL,

You really think Apple would try to use DirectX?

#183275

Originally posted by Sid@Jun 28 2004, 09:24 PM

/jaw drops in utter disbelief.

babypapichulo I've said it before and I will say it once again. You are a complete moron.

<_<

I think Ailim agrees with me...right?

Hey look at the difference from XP to Longhorn, then look at Panther to Tiger!

Wich OS will have more inovations??? :canadian: I am not a moron you just Love Apple no matter what crap they do. <_<

Yes I know Direct X is from Microsoft..BUT It's better than Open GL for OS's..It sure makes Longhorn faster than Panther from what I've seen in comments by REAL tester and people who saw it live and fresh in they're face!

#183280

Originally posted by babypapichulo@Jun 28 2004, 05:28 PM

<_<

I think Ailim agrees with me...right?

Hey look at the difference from XP to Longhorn, then look at Panther to Tiger!

Wich OS will have more inovations??? :canadian:  I am not a moron you just Love Apple no matter what crap they do.  <_<

ROFL....

If you ask anyone on this forum who knows me, they'll tell you there's no bigger Apple-hater on this forum than me (except maybe DZ who loves AMD).

So the "You just love Apple no matter what...." statement just take it and..... you get the idea. :6

As contrasutra stated earlier, the reason why Apple releases these yearly updates are to keep the OS X kernel updated. So the enhancements are under-the-hood and the so-called "new features" are just cosmetics that will make the end-user upgrade his system to this "new" OS.

If you want more clarification read his post. I don't think I should waste anymore of my time with you. :6

EDIT: You have no idea what you are going on about regarding DirectX and OpenGL so it might be wise for you to stop posting now.

EDIT2: Thanks GillBates.

#183282

I think what sid meant was this:

Originally posted by http://foldoc.doc.ic.ac.uk/foldoc/foldoc.cgi?query=directx

A Microsoft programming interface standard, first included with Windows 95. DirectX gives (games) programmers a standard way to gain direct access to enhanced hardware features under Windows 95 instead of going via the Windows 95 GDI. Some DirectX code runs faster than the equivalent under MS DOS.

DirectX promises performance improvements for graphics, sound, video, 3D, and network capabilites of games, but only where both hardware and software support DirectX.

DirectX 2 introduced the Direct3D interface. Version 5 was current at 1998-02-01. Version 8.1 is included in Windows XP.

Current version: 8.1 (as of 2001-12-31).

...so basically "no DirectX for OS X", doesn't matter that they rhyme

It's just that Sid likes to summarize sometimes.

#183283

i don't really understand the tiger/longhorn comparisons... xp to longhorn is at least a 4/5 year dif.

in addition to that, look at the new features apple is listing... they're right along the lines of what ms has been hyping up as 'revolutionary' features for longhorn(in two years yet)

for example.

improved database search - spotlight. check

improved a/v chat - ichat a/v. check

speech recognition - voiceover. check

plus apple seems to be ahead in shifting to 64 bit (yeah, its only a start but whatever)

and the min. specs (not finalized) for longhorn mean that hardware isn't likely to be all that cheap if you want to actually use it to its full potential.

seems to me apple is still getting the better of ms. (though i don't know much about computers, correct me if i'm wrong)

ps: the person in the voiceover banner blue icon looks anorexic

#183288

@realitybath: Yes, but remember that you are comparing two entirely different computer architectures let alone operating systems. As has been stated several times such a comparison is meaningless.

#183290

yeah, i know that argument, but i'm thinking just features, not performance (i just threw the 64 bit thing in i dunno)

#183294

Microsoft support 64bit proc in Longhorn and XP 64bit edition, the reson why Longhorn Demands so much power is cause Iof all the things that it will introduce. I am not saying Apple shouldn't update thier OS every year. They should. It is a good decision and that is why most people (my friends) use Mac's. Because it is always beging updated. BUT I feel that they aren't updating much..List all the resons to realy update. Yes it's looking nicer. Yes it's going to fix bugs. BUT if it's out by 2005 Apple is just rushing to realese it before Longhorn. Lets face it. Microsft has Monopily over the OS manufacturing. Apple doesn't. As much as You huys (most of you) love Apple admit that they only own about 7 to 10 (maybe less) percent of all computers. Apple wont last long plain and simple. I'll tell you why Microsoft doesn't release a New OS every year..No need to. They will still make more money than Apple. And Apple releases their OS every year. All Microsoft does is release a Service Pack and a couple LOTS of updates because they know by releasing Updates they are fixing the same amount of bugs Apple fixes by releasing a new OS...

#183302

Microsoft has a monopoly over the OS manufacturing for two main reasons: Cost, and appeal.

Face it- x86, and Microsoft OS's, cost (on the whole) a heck of a lot less than Macintosh's do. Oh, I know all about the 700 eMac deal etc, but Windows is cheaper to buy.

Appeal- Microsoft may not have it now, but they had it when PC's were introduced, and that's what keeps them at the top. If every person who used Windows were forced to use OS X for several days, a fair number of them would probaby switch. But Microsoft had it first.

Apple will last long for several reasons-

1) Enough people want them. Maybe not 90% of the market share, but enough

2) Apple refers to the entire company, including iPods and all of their software. That has been enormously successful.

Your thing about Microsoft updating their OS whereas Apple releases a new one every year...what's the point? I'm not being sarcastic- what point are you trying to get across? That Microsoft is better than Apple? More stable? More wealthy? Please explain.

-nightcrawler1089

#183314

I mean that Microsoft doesn't need to release a new OS t o keep thier customers. Apple mostly does so to get more money. They make lots of money off that. M$ releases thier OS's on a three to 5 year basses now. Apple is 1. Why? Even thought they always release only small updates it's so they can make more and more money. To keep them in the bussiness. At least that is how I see it.

#183327

I'VE HAD IT!

This smacks of a product rushed to the market just to beat a deadline. Lets step back from the really juveline adoration of Apple'$ products.

What if apple had held back from releasing O$ 10.1 &10.2 and put all those innovations into 10.3 or even 10.4?. That would have been awesome. Greatly improved gui, speed... Now we have a probably semi-polished O$ with 2 or 3 major updates down the road before 10.5, maybe.

The promise of 150 upgrades, yeah right. How many of those are actually major? or just minor tweaks? Anyone have a clue or are we just supposed to buy the B*S.

#183352

Originally posted by Stevie BM@Jun 28 2004, 07:38 PM

I want a fourth generation iPod.

I want one now.

I'm disappointed that they didn't announce them.

What more need I say?

Is that haiku?

haiku

is there a 4th gen iPod pic already? rumors...rumors....

-cherrysoul

#183435

Originally posted by RoyalPain@Jun 29 2004, 12:02 AM

I'VE HAD IT!

This smacks of a product rushed to the market just to beat a deadline. Lets step back from the really juveline adoration of Apple'$ products.

What if apple had held back from releasing O$ 10.1 &10.2 and put all those innovations into 10.3 or even 10.4?. That would have been awesome. Greatly improved gui, speed... Now we have a probably semi-polished O$ with 2 or 3 major updates down the road before 10.5, maybe.

The promise of 150 upgrades, yeah right. How many of those are actually major? or just minor tweaks? Anyone have a clue or are we just supposed to buy the B*S.

I like you! :rock:

You understand the piont I was trying to prove. Microsoft makes less frequent OS's but they include WAY more major changes than Apples. Thier stategy is to do minor updates and release fequently to make money (something they need more of so they can hire better programers) and how do they get our attention you ask??? By making it pretty. That sucks alot of attention into thier OS. Am I the only one who knpws about the iTunes incident??

#183442

Originally posted by nightcrawler1089@Jun 28 2004, 10:29 PM

Microsoft has a monopoly over the OS manufacturing for two main reasons: Cost, and appeal.

Not quite. Another reason is that they were the first to really get a proper OS to the market. I don't mean they invented it first, that was some bright person at the Xerox PARC. But, they were the first to deliver their offering to a major hardware manufacturer (IBM) and get it on the market in a big way. Nobody else did that.

Maybe, if apple had beaten them to it, you'd all be emulating luna, and complaining about aqua.

@babypapichulo: You aren't listening. Those 150 new things, the yearly updates? Refer back to contra's post. They're keeping the kernel and mach subsystem up to date.

#183463

Originally posted by Ludge@Jun 29 2004, 06:48 AM

Refer back to contra's post. They're keeping the kernel and mach subsystem up to date.

I know what you guys ment. I am saying that they lie. Is there any actual proff that they are making such fixes as they claim? That is what I meant. I guess I am a ass cause no one understands me... :cry: I need to learn how to express myself in more detail.

#183466

After watching the webcast I must say that Spotlight and Core Image really impressed me

There might be more going on in tiger than meets the eye.

#183470

I simply cannot beleive that after you people come here clamoring over apple's products you sit here and bi*ch and wine, why? Because the update isn't good enough????!!

MY GOD PEOPLE! The amount of features they've added to Tiger are more than enough to warrant a new OS release. Spotlight alone is an amazing feat. The quickness of searching is amazing yes, but what is really great is the way it is organized. MS could never create a searching interface that clean and well...useful.

Automator for me, and I'm sure MANY other people, are anxiously waiting to try, scripting is a pain in the ass for most people, this is going to make so many things so much easier.

Yes the displays are expensive, but are there any other monitors out there that can match them, in terms of style and quality? (As far as the design goes....why are some of you stuck in the past? Things change, please try to accept it)

Yes Dashboard is a Konfabulator clone, but it's more useful the way Apple has implemented it.

As far as the Longhorn versus Tiger thing goes....well, estimated release for Longhorn is 2006-07, won't there probably be a new MacOS version by then.

Now Tigers GUI may not appeal to some of you, we are spoiled with our beautiful skins, but the first significant GUI changes weren't made until Panther. 10.0 - 10.2

were very similar.

Bah, I'm done :rant:

#183484

Originally posted by grim53@Jun 28 2004, 10:12 PM

exaclty. it just looks like panther! not even the default wallpaper was changed.

from a visual stand point. there dosn't seem to be much of an update.

atleast with what we have to go with.

Yeah let's not update to Tiger because there is no new default wallpaper!!

I'd just like to mention a few points that people seemed to have missed;

• Tiger isn't out for another 6/7-12 months. The UI will be refined (hopefully) and features such as Dashboard are labeled as 'being worked on', I highly doubt such poor quality widgets will be in the final product.

• The 20" Display is like £200 cheaper than the previous generation, how can you complain about that?

@RoyalPain; 10.1 was the first considered 'complete' Mac OS X. 10.2 improved on it, and Panther improved on that again. As Contra said - it is easier for Apple to update at around 12-16 months to keep the system completely up to date, without annoying a lot of people by breaking application compatibility.

The two things that really interest me in Tiger are Automator and Spotlight. No it's not just another search engine, read about it - just the ability to have it search through all my files for a word or phrase, any of the stuff it can do is amazing. Automator will mean anyone will be able to take advantage of the 'Pipeline' technique/technology that Unix-geeks have been using, it's "Scripting for the rest of us." Dashboard, as long as it gets done properly, will be a good addition to Exposé - I personally do not like having to launch Calculator every time I'm too lazy to work something out in my head.

Tiger may not be the amazingly new Mac OS, maybe you expected the same "big" update as Panther? It'll still be an advanced OS, and they can only add to it over time - it's not like you'll be losing features.

Edit: Now I'm off to watch the webcast - maybe it'll impress me more.

#183500

Originally posted by es.xxi@Jun 29 2004, 03:18 AM

@RoyalPain; 10.1 was the first considered 'complete' Mac OS X. 10.2 improved on it, and Panther improved on that again. As Contra said - it is easier for Apple to update at around 12-16 months to keep the system completely up to date, without annoying a lot of people by breaking application compatibility.

Just for people who dont know...(not talking to you es.xxi, i think you know what you are talking about)

10.0 Cheetah

10.1 Puma

anyways, what do you mean "complete"?

#183514

Originally posted by Lou@Jun 29 2004, 02:48 AM

Just for people who dont know...(not talking to you es.xxi, i think you know what you are talking about)

10.0 Cheetah

10.1 Puma

anyways, what do you mean "complete"?

/inserts his 2 cents....

As far as I recall, Cheetah wasn't really the fastest cat... it was more like a pretty cat that limped along if you get my drift; in other words: it looked nice but it sucked a bit. That's why Apple made the update to 10.1 a free one (a reeeeeeaally needed one!).

#183520