I had originally had this as a poll, but i can't get the poll thing to work quite right (read: i'm a moron), so i'll just do it this way...
Question:
How do you all feel about the paying for point releases setup apple has going? 10.2 was a pay release, and now it looks like 10.3 will be for sure as well.
It will cost 130usd I think.
I cant tell you how I feel because I wont buy it, since I dont have a mac.
It is dumb to be paying for updates, and I consider this not that good to be charging for this important update, however if the new stuff added to it is worth, then it wont be so bad.
And even if you want or not, sooner or later you will be forced to update to it, because new applications wont run on jaguar, specially apple applications. I don think you can stand more than 6 months running 10.2 after 10.3 is released, because the new apple applications and updates will tell you that you need Panther/10.3 So even if you want ot not you will be forced.
thats one of the things I dont like about apple, if you have os 8 you cant do anything right now, it has turned to be kinda obsolete, and os 9 is about to get there. It is not like windows, where people run windows 98 and still can have new applications liek explorer 6, etc.
EVERYONE pays for point releases. Win2k = NT 5.0. XP = NT 5.1.
As far as older OS's being deprecated, well, it happens in the Windows world too, just not as fast. I would assume that is because basically Win95, Win98, and WinME are essentially all the same OS, with small changes in each. In XP, you can run programs in compatibility mode, in OSX you run them in Classic. It's not exactly the same, but same idea.
If you want the newest apps, then you should have the newest OS to run them on. I don't think people's insufficient systems should halt progress on researching and developing new technologies.
My opinion: - FAIR to pay -
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why?
EVERYTHING that is brand new in windows has to be paid for.
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I [sarcastically]think[/sarcastically] its a lot cheaper.
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Regardless, all the sp1, sp2, sp3 etc, are NOT A COMPARISON to 10.1 update to 10.2 and now 10.3 in the OS X series. Why?
Unlike MS, APPLE® has always improved GUI interfaces thoroughly, with fixed and tons of new more features and layout commands that once you compare it to a windows OS differences you need to first, go back in time and then see its similar to the differences between 98 and ME. It still look somewhat similar but ME was a lot better and faster, with really higher fps desktop rendering, for example.
Please dont tell me that all the 10.x are based on the same concept so the gui is somewhat different.. no my friends. You guys must see the tremandous work apple® puts in it!
Also, like MS, Apple® update their users throughout the time with so many updates and a fast schedule you hardly ever have that with windows. On top of that, you get to have some sord of 'sp1', 'sp2' type of updates whenever a 3rd-figure update comes out, such as: 10.2.3, 10.2.4,...10.2.6 now.
If yall assuming sp1, sp2, sp3 (that comes for free) are equvilant to 10.1, 10.2, 10.3 you're awfully wrong my PC friends.
So as the architect replied to neo asking 'the oracle?': "oh pffft, pleeeaase."
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1$ per feature.... 1$ for a song, 1$ for a 20min long distance phone call... what else for 1$?
OK. I dont mind Apple charging for the point releases, because they are almost a whole new OS. And they aren't in the same financial position MS is in.
What I dont like is the 0 legacy support. For example, if your running 10.1, you cant get ANY security updates. Thats just wrong. Its ok if they dont give you any new features for free (MS doesnt), but they should fix the bugs they make. Its not your fault an OS has holes, and its Apples job to fix it, FOR FREE!
MS fixes their (many) security holes/bugs for OSs many years after their prime. They were fixing Windows 98 holes up until this year.
Its just irresponsible of Apple to say that "You have to have an insecure OS, that you payed REALLY good money for, unless you pay another $130".
So in conclusion, Apple are poor jerks. 
timmie, now M$ is going to make their own music industry, so i wanna see how much money they will charge their users.
btw tim dog you anti-Mac, if you wanna get a hotmail account prepare yourself for $10.
Do you really want me to list all the evil and melicious actions Microsoft has been doing ever since 83' (excpt one lately)?
Originally posted by contrasutra@Jun 23 2003, 02:37 PMOK. I dont mind Apple charging for the point releases, because they are almost a whole new OS. And they aren't in the same financial position MS is in.
What I dont like is the 0 legacy support. For example, if your running 10.1, you cant get ANY security updates. Thats just wrong. Its ok if they dont give you any new features for free (MS doesnt), but they should fix the bugs they make. Its not your fault an OS has holes, and its Apples job to fix it, FOR FREE!
MS fixes their (many) security holes/bugs for OSs many years after their prime. They were fixing Windows 98 holes up until this year.
Its just irresponsible of Apple to say that "You have to have an insecure OS, that you payed REALLY good money for, unless you pay another $130".
So in conclusion, Apple are poor jerks.
dude you're so wrong i wanna ***** slap you.
seriously you're a young oblivious kid that heard stories about things and you never had a chance to physically have a mac and see updates for yourself.
first if you have windows without zone alarm , you're dead.
second of all, apple® constantly update the security holes in their os, wth are you talking about?
My mac is mountains more secure than my PC.
Also apple® still fixes and updates stuff in the Classic OS9. please be quite and dont squawk unless you know what you're talking about. obviously you sence you got my veins enlarged.
EDIT - i see nrzero here, lets see what he's got to say :smartass:
Originally posted by contrasutra@Jun 23 2003, 10:37 PMIts not your fault an OS has holes, and its Apples job to fix it, FOR FREE!
exactly, because they should offer a customer service that repair any fault the product might have, just like electronic devices and any other product.
So, wait? If you run "Apple update" (or whatever its called 
) in 10.1, OS9 or whatever, you will still recieve security updates?
Your right, I have never had a mac, and all I ever hear is 10.2.5 , 10.2.6 is out. I never hear 10.1.2 , 10.1.3.
If they do give security updates for older OSs, then I am wrong, and your ***** slap is accepted.
Originally posted by cho008@Jun 23 2003, 03:09 PMexactly, because they should offer a customer service that repair any fault the product might have, just like electronic devices and any other product.
you probably ignored the posts i written above.
Apple fixes and updates if you dont know.
even contrasutra gave up on the light that bursts out of me :goku: ®.
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Contrasutra your acceptence for my ***** slapping is appealing. *****.
:sone:
:harp:
So when was the last OS10.1 update? Do they update it evey time a 10.2 update is released? Do they still keep number updates, like 10.1.3 , 10.1.4?
Taha had told me they dont, so my mind was poisoned by one of you mac-ies..
$400 brand new... i dun think so.
Microsoft at least offer upgrade packages for inbetween point releases
eg 95 -98 98-ME etc
those upgrade fees were about $30
Actually, upgrade prices for almost any version. If you have 98, you can use an upgrade version of XP for $75 OEM or $99 retail.
I love how people inflat prices sometimes.
On the other hand, OSX gives you a 5 computer liscence for like $200, when that would cost you $500 in upgrades (not even going to talk about full version) for XP.
Personally, they are all liars,every single one them. Dirty rotten liars.
@Contra: a security update does not show up as Mac OS x.x.x, it shows up as 'Security Update'. The 10.2.x means other stuff.
eg, 10.2.5 and a security update were released together and I downloaded them seperately.
Yah but the Microsoft updates only come about every 2 years. The service paks don't cost anything. Apple is making you pay for a yearly update. I for one probably won't be updating because Apple has probably worked the code again to make it dificult to imposible to get it to work on an older system. So until Apple bring out a sub $1k ystem no money from me. I already went this rout with them and I am not getting stung agian. I will find a nice used system on ebay before I give them a dime for a new system. Its just my personal feelings on this.
Originally posted by contrasutra@Jun 23 2003, 04:50 PMActually, upgrade prices for almost any version. If you have 98, you can use an upgrade version of XP for $75 OEM or $99 retail.
I love how people inflat prices sometimes.
On the other hand, OSX gives you a 5 computer liscence for like $200, when that would cost you $500 in upgrades (not even going to talk about full version) for XP.
Personally, they are all liars,every single one them. Dirty rotten liars.
Thank you.
At last you see the whole picture.
People who say "why should i pay for the 10.3" (obviously dont understand what that update means, again its like 98 and ME etc), are exactly like those girls who ask "whats the difference between porche and corvette? they are both sports cars, ill get the cheaper one, like whateva, like dah" :hippi:
****** slapping and shouting*: "WAAAAAKE UUUP!!!!!" By rage against the machine/matrix
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Thank you impulseman! RIGHT SAID!
Yah but the Microsoft updates only come about every 2 years. The service paks don't cost anything. Apple is making you pay for a yearly update. I for one probably won't be updating because Apple has probably worked the code again to make it dificult to imposible to get it to work on an older system. So until Apple bring out a sub $1k ystem no money from me. I already went this rout with them and I am not getting stung agian. I will find a nice used system on ebay before I give them a dime for a new system. Its just my personal feelings on this.
Ha.. some hope. thanks for showing it to me impulsman, taha and you too contrasutra for waking up and seeing the whole picture.
some good discussion so far...
my main problem is what was mentioned above, how apple phases out the old OS version, like how everything now is "jaguar required". This is dirty, and there are ways around it if they wanted to do it. MS is actually decent about this (NOTE: i'm not saying they're great either, but they are definately better, a friend of mine is running windows98 right now and plays all the newest games, no problem). On my mac, i bought it at 10.0, then got 10.2, and i think i'm done with apple now, i'm not paying for another update to 10.3 just for their justification that the finder is all better and pretty now and you can organize fonts, i don't care, i don't need that crap. So basically, so far, i've overpaid for my original mac system (old g4 tower), overpaid for an update that didn't do much i needed it for other than run new applications, and now they want me to overpay for something i have absolutely no use for. Mac makes me sad anymore 
(Please note that above i am using overpaid in comparison to pc, don't even start with me on those calculators kids, i ran the numbers, for my business i have to save money, mac doesn't cut it, and whoever stated 500 for windows xp, you make baby jesus cry, its 200 if you consider it an upgrade, and thats if you don't shop around at all, i got mine for 100.)
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