Aqua-Soft Forumsit's the 500 calorie salad!
Debate - Whos’e To Blame For Americas Obesity
Originally posted by bunkka@Apr 29 2004, 04:48 PM...makes u more intelectual...
Oh come one, you can do better than that!
Originally posted by bunkka@Apr 30 2004, 12:48 AMi really dont care where this thread goes from now on, but debating makes u more intelectual so i think we should have something like this every week. make us smarter.
-bunkka :canadian:
\\cause u know the ole bunkster needs to learn.
oooo that would be cool, have a weekly official A-S debate.
Originally posted by lostspyder@Apr 30 2004, 04:25 AMoooo that would be cool, have a weekly official A-S debate.
hey come on....i do. :woot:
-bunkka :canadian:
Originally posted by lostspyder@Apr 29 2004, 08:41 PMWow herd man, i totaly agree with you. THe human species is starting to move faster than evelution, and we are starting to prematurely move out of our evelutionary nitch. Man wasnt created to live in a society where everythign is done for us, and in fact the typical human is no more mentaly evolved then people living in the dark ages. Technology is cumulative , but mental evelution is not. Ths can be seen in the sharp increase of depresion, suicide and divorce over the last 100 years. It is my perional opinion that we are infact not in controll of anything, that every 'choice' we make is the sumnation of every occurance that as ever happend, or any event for that matter, because any external event is realy no diffrent from 'choice' then. A kind of unromantic fate. This illusion of choice is only there to keep humanity content. Look at it, you seriously think there is any room for choice in physics? These tiney molicules that govern the chemicals that govern ourselfs only have one outcome,and one can, given all requred information about the instant, calculate the outcome of that instant into the next (an equation that would take into acount an infinate amount of varables). This illusion fo choice is as much an evelutionary process as is feet, legs and lungs. Upon the inaguration of 'self', that is the ability to precive the outside world, our 'souls', somehting had to be created to counter the effects that the lack of choice made. Without choice we have no reason to love. I belive this idea of choice is quickly picked up as babys. The idea of fate also fixes the problems with the big bang theorie and tis effect on time. At some point the universe will stop expanding and will start to contract, at which point time will travel backwards, but with the idea of fate also comes the idea that ever instance is clearly defined, and that our passage through time is perception. Mabie we are all in the dawn of ourselfs, and when we travel back through time we gradual digress, we would have no recolection of going backwards, because all we could rember is this foward momentum weve had.
Whada ya think?
Yeah, Lostspyder, I agree with you to some extent.
If you put your faith in physics, like I do, you'll like the following ideas:
- Human fate can not be calculated, because of the uncertainity principle of Heisenberg.
The freedom of choice may be illusional or not, yet this can not be proven because of the quantum principle. Albeit these submolecular forces, even a thought in a perfectly duplicated brain can not be thought or made be thought a second time. Our neurons can do quantum calculations (whose outcome can not be predicted by deterministic computers) by means of microtubulae that are capable to propagate the quantum state into the macrocosm of a multitude of neurons. Thanks to that, we can do bipedal walking with steering wires that operate at the speed of sound: our biological CPU components can thereby predict the future to a few hundred milliseconds to some accuracy. A goalkeeper jumping to the false side of the goal on a penalty shot reveals that our predictions are not always accurate. Another impact of the quantum state is our self consciousness - sedated people or people lying in a coma have lost this ability altogether and are, therefore, unconscious.
You may convince yourself about these ideas by reading Roger Penrose's "Shadows Of The Mind" book.
- Time will not travel backwards when the big bang has eaten all its inertia and the big collapse begins. The sherds will not jump up to the table and form the smashed cup again. We perceive time running forward because of our brains again. It generates a lot of entropy (rise in disorder) to get things percieved and calculated. The future will therefore always point in the same direction as entropy and when the universe collapses (which is not proven yet) entropy will still rise until the big crunch evens out all uncertainity in a pre-bang singularity. I like the idea that the universe will contract and expand again, like the four stroke 500cc single cylinder of my motorbike does.
You may convince yourself about this idea by reading Stephen W. Hawkings "A Brief History of Time"
Finally, to the freedom of choice again: There is one in my book. It's somewhat limited because I can't avoid to drool when I'm hungry and the smell of some food hits my nose. That's as OK with me as the erection I can't avoid when my girl enters the room (sigh) but there are also some limitations I'd be better without, e.g. prejudices inherited or educated from and by parents, teachers, society. Thank goodness I'm in no way limited by religion - that would narrow down my sight too much. And I don't believe in souls, until someone shows me a medium that's capable of recording and sustaining all my quantum states without a physical body, which I think Penrose has ruled out totally.
From dust we came and to dust we go.
But I somewhat believe in history repeating itself; if the multiverse is infinite, there'll always be infinite me's around that are enjoying themselves very much in a debate with infinite numbers of you's. While this kind of things happen very rarely on this board due to the young age of its members and their regrettably short attention span, the multiverse offers better and worse situations than that and I can still hope that our aqua-trek will continue and flourish.
I blame George Bush <_
IT'S THE SALAD!!
If you look to yourself in the mirror and notice some few extra 50 pounds I think you should have brain enough to stop eating junk and eat something else and exercise.
It's not that people don't have the information, the problem is that people are too lazy to do what needs to be done. So they prefer to stay as they are (overweight). :cartman:
Originally posted by ZiUL@May 4 2004, 06:15 PMIt's not that people don't have the information, the problem is that people are too lazy to do what needs to be done. So they prefer to stay as they are (overweight). :cartman:
annnddd why are they lazy? Society. :canadian:
Originally posted by lostspyder@May 4 2004, 06:18 PMannnddd why are they lazy? Society. :canadian:
But you can't blame the society. You're part of it (the society) as I'm too.
Now let's say that Mr. Somebody have a "size" problem. Now because he stayed at home eating like there's no tomorow it's not my fault and nobodyelse but his own fault.
Bahh... whatever, thin people will rule the world 
Enough about other people problem :6
Peace
... salad?
Originally posted by ZiUL@May 4 2004, 08:15 PMIf you look to yourself in the mirror and notice some few extra 50 pounds I think you should have brain enough to stop eating junk and eat something else and exercise.
No matter what you eat, good or bad, if you consume more calories than
you spend (e.g. on Sabretooth Tiger hunting) the difference becomes fat.
The only reliable way of burning fat is using mother nature's way by using
your muscles. That needs exercise, and that needs time, and time is a rare good in
our society - we are, by and large, so stressed by society in our cushioned jobs
without heavy lifting that we don't have time to exercise. Again, society is to blame.
Yes, individual effort can help. But if the social environment does not encourage
this, the majority will "choose" the easy way and gain weight.
It took me only two days to get rid of my 20 to 30 push-ups after waking up but it
took me 10 months of (compulsory) military service to get accustomed to it.
let's do a new poll. list your weight with your post. i have a feeling those who blame society are rather thick and heavy people who don't want to take any responsibility for themselves, and those who are as skinny as a rail want to take all the credit. (i am 150 lbs.)
my own feeling is it is 110% the individuals fault. first of all, food is only a small part of the problem. the bigger part has to do with actually pushing yourself away from your computer for part of the day and hit up the weight room or go running or do something! eat less, and eat better. IT'S NOT THAT HARD!!!!! every fast food restaurant has healthy alternatives. buy a sald, buy your burger with no mayonaise, eat chicken instead of beef, etc. quit blaming everyone else and look in the mirror and ask yourself "what am i actively doing to solve my weight problem." that's the real problem in this country. a total lack of responsibility, respect for oneself, and a blatent disregard for consequences of actions.
i rest my case 
Originally posted by Benjimanis@May 5 2004, 05:05 PMlet's do a new poll. list your weight with your post. i have a feeling those who blame society are rather thick and heavy people who don't want to take any responsibility for themselves, and those who are as skinny as a rail want to take all the credit. (i am 150 lbs.)
my own feeling is it is 110% the individuals fault. first of all, food is only a small part of the problem. the bigger part has to do with actually pushing yourself away from your computer for part of the day and hit up the weight room or go running or do something! eat less, and eat better. IT'S NOT THAT HARD!!!!! every fast food restaurant has healthy alternatives. buy a sald, buy your burger with no mayonaise, eat chicken instead of beef, etc. quit blaming everyone else and look in the mirror and ask yourself "what am i actively doing to solve my weight problem." that's the real problem in this country. a total lack of responsibility, respect for oneself, and a blatent disregard for consequences of actions.
i rest my case
great job i was going to post the same thing. its how you spend your day and what you are doing to solve the weight problem. other citizens are not responsible for my body, nor should i expect them to. people have hectic lives, you can substitute something from your busy lives to go work out, or eat a healthy meal instead of ordering the good/fatening stuff.
-bunkka :canadian:
I don't know you very well, so my analogy may not work. But since this is a community geared toward apple: Why don't you buy a Creative NOMAD MuVo2 instead of an iPod? Because you want something that you can savor. You want to enjoy, you don't want to punish yourselves. There is only a few people that blame everyone else. Those are the people that sue because they feed their children McDonalds food everyday. Or people who sue because they don't know that coffee is meant to be served hot. It's those few that screw it up for the rest. Alot of people are happy even though they are big.buy a sald, buy your burger with no mayonaise, eat chicken instead of beef, etc.
Again, I am on neither side, I say it is a mixture of both.
Edit Spelling.
Originally posted by wizard@May 5 2004, 05:27 PMWhy don't you buy a Creative NOMAD MuVo2 instead of an iPod?
i dont know how you can apply this analogy. one thing is a luxury and doesn't affect your health. One you dont need and one you need to survive. Yes i love fast food, fattening....etc but i do have self control to tell myself when to stop. some people dont have this [this is because they havn't taken the time to practice this self control]. but to blame other people for the problem you brought on yourself [not everyone] is just the lazy way out, and you are trying rationalize something that you had control over. plus how have i pursueded someone i dont know nor met to eat fattening food?
I can see where your comming from wizard with the whole apple/creative thing, but others might not.
[here is my attempt at one]
Example: If you see a powerbook on sale for 1400 fully loaded....blah blah blah. and you only have 1000 for it. what do you do? you dont buy it. why? because you would be in debt [not that people dont buy off of impulses, but its not wise to].
Example: If you see a pizza that is looks heavenly sweet, but you know your body doesn't respond to fatty foods well. what do you do? you buy the salad instead. why? because you know you are going to gain weight if you buy the pizza instead.
in the end i really dont care, because i should not be responsible for someone else in new york. they shouldn't use me [society] as a scape goat for their lazyness. Im fit because i choose to be fit .
-bunkka :canadian:
Originally posted by amnesia@Apr 29 2004, 08:40 AMThe first thing that popped in my head is McDonalds.
Same here. I'm bone thin 120lbs 5, 9 and i love it. I think its the indivitual who makes the choice to become fat or not. And because everyone has different body types. For instence i could eat at McDonalds all of my life and be bone thin. And others could eat there for a week and gain 10lbs 
os basicly its according to the body type. 
thats my two cents
Originally posted by Enhanced@May 5 2004, 06:46 PMSame here. I'm bone thin 120lbs 5, 9 and i love it. I think its the indivitual who makes the choice to become fat or not. And because everyone has different body types. For instence i could eat at McDonalds all of my life and be bone thin. And others could eat there for a week and gain 10lbs
thats my two cents
dude im 5' 9" 125lbs. hehe same here with the mcdonalds thing. fast ass metabolism. yay there are more people like me....hehe
-bunkka :canadian:
Steve Jobs....blame everything on that guy
Well i debated for an hour, and got an A for it if anyone cared to know.
Im not so sure about that...
geans play a good part in it but even people with fat geans can be skinny
they just have to try, and diet...
You tool! You used us! 